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Itren

Diamond Founder: Aura Kingdom
Itren
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PostedDec 19, 2013 5:00 am
I believe the subclass change costs around 4k loyalty points. I can't remember exactly and I uninstalled the chinese version so can't check.
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xHitokiri

Diamond Founder: Aura Kingdom
xHitokiri
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PostedDec 19, 2013 5:58 am
I can kill anyone except Bards with that build and sub as duelist, the only reason Bard are so annoying is the heals, without going ravager you dont have the stuns you need to beat them, that would be the only reason I would take ravager as a sub, but I prefer PvE, the PvP on this game does not seem to have much use right now ? correct me if im wrong.
I did think about going with bard as a sub, for the heals but what other use does it have as a sub?

Kirito wrote:
Aww I died again hehe, sorry did not see the red lines, was watching TV.

Itren

Diamond Founder: Aura Kingdom
Itren
Joined
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PostedDec 19, 2013 6:04 am
xHitokiri wrote:
what other use does it have as a sub?  

+% defense

I'm not sold on bard myself, debating between it and 2 others.

xHitokiri

Diamond Founder: Aura Kingdom
xHitokiri
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PostedDec 19, 2013 6:06 am
Making a bard to see what their skills are like for pve stuff, if it's better for what I want in pve then I will probably use that in OBT.

Kirito wrote:
Aww I died again hehe, sorry did not see the red lines, was watching TV.

mirukomi

Rank 2
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PostedDec 19, 2013 7:29 am
xHitokiri wrote:
I can kill anyone except Bards with that build and sub as duelist, the only reason Bard are so annoying is the heals, without going ravager you dont have the stuns you need to beat them, that would be the only reason I would take ravager as a sub, but I prefer PvE, the PvP on this game does not seem to have much use right now ? correct me if im wrong.
I did think about going with bard as a sub, for the heals but what other use does it have as a sub?  

I must say i didn't want to sound so affirmative or offensive on my last post. I wanted to avoid you, fellow guardians, to face some problem at later lvls.

If have to explain a bit more my opinion on guardian i'd say:
-it's not rly a pvp focused class, the current pvp (arena) revolve around teamfights, aside duel which are just for "fun", your utility in those teamfight are very limited, people don't need to kill you and you can't really kill them since it's not a duel, all you can do is use some CC on them to help your mates.

-PvE-wise, guardian is with bard the less damaging class, while questing you will rely mainly on your eidolon to finish the job.
In instances, while in this beta you feel wanted in pt, you'll realize later, unless our version get a serious buff on dungeon mobs, most pt won't need a tank, simply because a well geared character can do the job (tank) and even solo the instances. At lv 60 instances are hard, untill people get again well geared you will shine again, and will be needed in pt. Unfortunately the same scenario will happen and you might be left aside because as long as lvl and gears ppl won't need that much of a tank (while bard will still be needed).
Fortunately very hard instnace like sky tower will save you, because on this peculiar dungeons ppl will need you.

-Now about the subs, duelist, ravager or bard are totally legit builds, it's really a matter of role and preference, as i said if you go the way of ultimate tank the subs go bard>ravager>duelist.

Bard sub is for tankiness, you get many heals, HOT (this will allow your bard in pt to ignore you a bit and also avoid getting aggroed), and a stun (which range can be enhanced greatly by a blue secret stone). You won't die easily at the cost of your dmg (which can be negated by +20 your sword) however again at later lvls if ppl need a tank they will chose you compared to a tank with damage.

Ravager and duelist subs, are totally fine, but unlike harp they rely more on lifesteal (which will cost a lot as gears), they have more damage, Ravager comes with a set that allows you with it's extra large aie stun to keep almost full time large amount of mobs aggroed, while duelist will be able to aoe damage alot as well as DoT the boss.


TL;DR
I said it the wrong waylast time but all subs discussed are fine, from my experience of high lvl, let's be honest if you're a guardian you want to fulfill your role to its maximun, thus instead of being average in many ways tank/dmg, it's somehow better to be a pure meat shield. The only downside is the questing, you better +20 your sword, regarding pvp it's so-so just support your team like an unkillable bard.

Daniluvkari

Rank 0
Daniluvkari
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Fiore Japan
PostedDec 19, 2013 9:20 am
weird, hmm in the TW normally was HP, speed and attack nothing else, and they could control agro and survive more than the ones using DEF+ stat.

xHitokiri

Diamond Founder: Aura Kingdom
xHitokiri
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PostedDec 19, 2013 9:24 am
mirukomi wrote:
just support your team like an unkillable bard.  


That's the only reason I am thinking about bard as a sub, grim also gives you a heal though, like 3 of them, and stuns and sleep and some decent damage i guess, what do you think about grim as a tanks sub?
Still get to be tanky, heal and support and lots of cc, not sure how good the heals are though.

Kirito wrote:
Aww I died again hehe, sorry did not see the red lines, was watching TV.

mirukomi

Rank 2
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454
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PostedDec 19, 2013 9:37 am
xHitokiri wrote:
mirukomi wrote:
just support your team like an unkillable bard.  


That's the only reason I am thinking about bard as a sub, grim also gives you a heal though, like 3 of them, and stuns and sleep and some decent damage i guess, what do you think about grim as a tanks sub?
Still get to be tanky, heal and support and lots of cc, not sure how good the heals are though.  

the problem is that the grim heal is very tiny compared to the 3 stacked HoT from bard. HoT from grim is mainly for removing debuff.

As guardian/bard you won't use your bard skills as damage skills, it's true that sorcerer sub is nice for it's CC and ranged skills. I've seen some guardian/sorcerer, but generally they prefer bard.

You have to consider also what sub orange weapon gives as buff/special trigger effect, bard weapons give defensive effects while sorcer gives damage effect.

While building your guardian make sure to consider your sub weapon stats and effects.

guardian/harp is very popular because you don't need super gears to do well, only weapon +20

If well geared a lv70 guardian can hit 100k hp, 75% def, 80k dmg along with harp sub for even more tankiness.

Daniluvkari wrote:
weird, hmm in the TW normally was HP, speed and attack nothing else, and they could control agro and survive more than the ones using DEF+ stat.  


yea that's it.
-they max def cap through adv road + gears+20 then they put all points in hp
-they cap speed with gears and food + buff and put some point in dmg.

But again you need the gears to do that, not all guardians are founded.

metalsnake73

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metalsnake73
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17 Aug 2010
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53
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United States
PostedDec 19, 2013 1:06 pm
That Duelist builds looks interesting, thanks for sharing!

In terms of Ravager sub build, most likely going to first max Speed and Def and see how that turns out.

In terms of Envoy's Path however, I'm lost. If anyone has a good idea for envoy's path for Guardian/Ravager can you share please? Or at least give some ideas?

Metalsnake27/Metals Metals.CS2, former DWO Player. DJ.Metals : DJMAX Online Chinese 2014 Server DJ.Metals: S4 League Yo! Let's Go!

khearts53

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khearts53
Joined
14 Dec 2013
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46
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Australia
PostedDec 19, 2013 3:34 pm
yeh u guys seem to know everything , wow i want to kill people in pvp but to me , theres no other class out there that interest me except for the shield and sword , so yeh if u guys know how to go with the envoys path , share ur thoughts guys .. thanks for the support
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