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JamesGodden

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JamesGodden
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PostedFeb 04, 2013 6:16 am

Re: Archers LUC vs STR

Question
pask81 wrote:
JamesGodden wrote:

Also that Ele table as far as imperical evidence goes is wrong. (On neutrals) Earth2 on Fire2 does less damage than Earth2 on Fire1 in PvP  


I always thought it was not logical that behavior, but never tested it Razz
Do you have any idea how it should be corrected?  


not really, one potential way to find out though, would be a naked 80 toon with no rec statted with a 15 top ele1 and 15 top same but ele2'ed

then a simple Tetanus to make their defence 0 in total, followed by an auto attack from an ele2'ed weapon on a naked toon (to make non-crit likely) to calc the difference over a few attacks then you'd have an answer

but I'm far to lazy and disinterested in the game these days to work it out Very Happy

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OneAndOnlyNISMO

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PostedFeb 04, 2013 8:38 am
seeing as seems to be allot on this post that know archer i need help to i need an archer expert to PM me and fix my stats
52 UM archer and is weaker and squishier then my HM 61 pure wis healer

pask81

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PostedFeb 04, 2013 8:43 am
Tested with the help of shaiya it friends: the table is correct and ele2 or ele1 weapons do same damage vs neutral ele1 top.

JamesGodden

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PostedFeb 04, 2013 9:00 am
pask81 wrote:
Tested with the help of shaiya it friends: the table is correct and ele2 or ele1 weapons do same damage vs neutral ele1 top.  


wrong test, though it indicates stuff.

Its ele2 weapon vs ele2 and ele1 neutral tops

OneAndOnlyNISMO wrote:
seeing as seems to be allot on this post that know archer i need help to i need an archer expert to PM me and fix my stats
52 UM archer and is weaker and squishier then my HM 61 pure wis healer
 


Those stats look bizarre Surprised like pretty much naked, especially since Enchants are now rescaled for attack massively on Archer/hunter

here are some pre-ep5 stats (no lvl7s no enchant rescaling) for a low ranked (two bar I think) 58UM archer Surprised



They'd be with a bow not an x-bow though

Edit:

They are really low, even episode4 ranger stats (no OJs, enchants, lvl6s, lvl7s, heck not even goddess gears) but have double the attack (though much lower luc considerably more dex)



So the obvious fix is wear at least dual linked legendary gear Smile

Sanni_shaiya

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PostedFeb 04, 2013 9:17 am
i have 52 um archer too, om not an expert, but i can solo jungle mobs 1 by 1 pretty well with sonicsand i'd suppose next: dex is kinda minimum on that lvl because archer is squishy for hard melee opponent so i'd suggest stat reset with new stats:

option 1:
total DEX to 200, rest points splitted abotu 55% STR 45% LUC

option 2: total DEX to 250, rest full STR

since luc is useless when one misses-->needs DEX (DEX gives also a bit help on squishiness when opponent starts to miss you )

since on hit needs STR to hit through target's defense ( ATK is needed in this phase ) and crit is calculated from that part of dmg dealt OVER target's defense

since total stats are so low ( not so much stats on gear ) i'd think at this situation a: relink gear, dreads with all lvl 5 STR DEX LUC that go to armor, rest slots with doublestat duals so you'd have 71-77 linked stats / item and for weapon although goddess bow or Piku Hawk with STR DEX or LUC base and as much OJs on those as possible, link it STR DEX LUX *** lvl 5, will be kinda cheap gear to build but will work for grinding

pask81

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PostedFeb 04, 2013 12:08 pm
The test was done by a GM of Shaiya IT.

Toon 1: war lv1 with axe lv1 linked fire ele1 or fire ele2
Toon 2: war lv5 with top earth lv1 and earth lv2

Each attack was repeated 3 times

1) Fire ele1 vs earth 1 : 39 - 38 - 35 dmg
2) Fire ele2 vs earth 1: 39 - 34 - 36 dmg

The results show no difference, but I was worried the attack was too low to show real effect, so he added 800 str to toon 1 and 800 rec to toon2 (GMs can do it Smile)

After this change toon1 had 1073 - 1081 attack and toon2 had 805 defense

3) Fire 1 vs earth 1: 276 - 271 - 270
4) Fire 2 vs earth 2: 271 - 271 - 273

It is evident that ele2 and ele1 vs neutral ele1 have same effect and it is 100% normal damage (considering attack and defense the normal damage is in the range 268-276)

After your reply I asked to repeat the test vs an earth 2 top, here are the results:

5) Fire 1 vs earth 2: 268 - 270 - 274
6) Fire 2 vs earth 2: 253 - 256 - 252

Apparently ele2 vs ele2 do less damage than ele1 vs ele2, same neutral elemnt Surprised

This makes no sense tbh, but I made him relog and test again to be sure bless and endurance was ok and the results were the same the 2nd time.

Furaiz

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PostedFeb 04, 2013 12:27 pm
pask81 wrote:
The test was done by a GM of Shaiya IT.

Toon 1: war lv1 with axe lv1 linked fire ele1 or fire ele2
Toon 2: war lv5 with top earth lv1 and earth lv2

Each attack was repeated 3 times

1) Fire ele1 vs earth 1 : 39 - 38 - 35 dmg
2) Fire ele2 vs earth 1: 39 - 34 - 36 dmg

The results show no difference, but I was worried the attack was too low to show real effect, so he added 800 str to toon 1 and 800 rec to toon2 (GMs can do it Smile)

After this change toon1 had 1073 - 1081 attack and toon2 had 805 defense

3) Fire 1 vs earth 1: 276 - 271 - 270
4) Fire 2 vs earth 2: 271 - 271 - 273

It is evident that ele2 and ele1 vs neutral ele1 have same effect and it is 100% normal damage (considering attack and defense the normal damage is in the range 268-276)

After your reply I asked to repeat the test vs an earth 2 top, here are the results:

5) Fire 1 vs earth 2: 268 - 270 - 274
6) Fire 2 vs earth 2: 253 - 256 - 252

Apparently ele2 vs ele2 do less damage than ele1 vs ele2, same neutral elemnt Surprised

This makes no sense tbh, but I made him relog and test again to be sure bless and endurance was ok and the results were the same the 2nd time.  


I don't suppose that 'bug' is evident with strong eles? e.g Fire 1 vs Wind 2?

Arthur5174

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PostedFeb 04, 2013 12:52 pm
did Rekikyo quit the forums/game? Haven't seen his analytical POV lately...would be interesting Idea

Hoppity

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PostedFeb 04, 2013 7:35 pm
+20 to y'all for the analysis
Applause and kudos to you also
tyvm for this

LoDebar

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PostedFeb 05, 2013 1:39 am
The fundamental problem with this question is that comparing two archers that have a 1000 attack but one has 200 LUC and the other has 400 LUC, these two archers do not have the same number of total stat points, thus no real comparison can be made due to lack of information.

When you run the numbers, 1 point in STR yields more damage on average than 1 point in LUC even when critting.
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