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caprontos

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caprontos
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PostedNov 25, 2012 6:55 pm
synster14 wrote:
My warrior friend(MPure) actually just gave me a great idea for increasing sorceress survivability issues.

Mana Aegis.
Replace Water Aegis with it, but keep Frozen Shield.

Mana Aegis will have 3 skill levels. It will be a toggle skill. It will solve both our survival and excess mana issues.

Mana Aegs:
While active, any damage taken will be subtracted from mana instead of health.
No cooldown.
Instant cast.
When you run out of mana, Mana Aegis automatically un-toggles.

Level 1. 1:5 ratio. 1 point of damage for 5 points of mana.
Level 2. 1:4 ratio. 1 point of damage for 4 points of mana.
Level 3. 1:3 ratio. 1 point of damage for 3 points of mana.


Rates can be adjusted.
Currently, I have 3k mana. At a 1:3 ratio. My mana would be gone in 2 hits.
Enough to allow me to survive and run away, like any class. But I wouldn't be able to stay and fight.  


This sounds fair to me.

May have to check what the MP levels will look like vs dmg at level 50 and beyond maybe.. but all in all it sounds about right.
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Un.Leashed

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PostedNov 25, 2012 8:14 pm
synster14 wrote:
My warrior friend(MPure) actually just gave me a great idea for increasing sorceress survivability issues.

Mana Aegis.
Replace Water Aegis with it, but keep Frozen Shield.

Mana Aegis will have 3 skill levels. It will be a toggle skill. It will solve both our survival and excess mana issues.

Mana Aegs:
While active, any damage taken will be subtracted from mana instead of health.
No cooldown.
Instant cast.
When you run out of mana, Mana Aegis automatically un-toggles.

Level 1. 1:5 ratio. 1 point of damage for 5 points of mana.
Level 2. 1:4 ratio. 1 point of damage for 4 points of mana.
Level 3. 1:3 ratio. 1 point of damage for 3 points of mana.


Rates can be adjusted.
Currently, I have 3k mana. At a 1:3 ratio. My mana would be gone in 2 hits.
Enough to allow me to survive and run away, like any class. But I wouldn't be able to stay and fight.  


Sorceres still need a lot of rework and the more i PvP the more certain i am about it in all kinds of diferent ways.

The insta cast range stuns/slows from melees would make the escape hard anyway but this is still a good idea tho (at least for the right tree sorcerers).

JustForFun3434

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PostedNov 25, 2012 8:47 pm   Last edited by JustForFun3434 on Nov 25, 2012 10:02 pm. Edited 1 time in total
I think Frost shield is bugged... im not sure if its bugged or not but when my frost shield freezes the monster that are attacking me it makes them immortal.. i can not dmg them at all until they get de-frost same thing happens in PVP...

just want to clarify if it's bugged or if that's how it meant to be, cause if that's so... its pretty dumb

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVjT74YMd4Y&feature=youtu.be

sorry about the bad quality.. i just rushed to upload this with the first recording program i found... stil you can clearly see the monster's hp is not going down nor im doing any dmg when he is frost

synster14

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synster14
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PostedNov 25, 2012 9:04 pm
I just did some more testing and found that the stats are heavily weighted away from sorcs.
I don't know if this is where I should post it, but I feel this is the most likely place for it to be seen, and that is what matters. Razz



I just did some more testing and found some new info.
I'm going to lump all the info together for ease of reading.

The Info.

Upon leveling, a character gains +1.5 attack, and +1 magic attack.
Upon placing a point in strength, a character gains +1 attack.
Upon placing a point in intelligence, a character gains +6 magic attack.
When upgrading a weapon +1, the weapon gains +10 attack and +40 magic attack if applicable.
At +15 a weapon gains +150 attack and + 600 magic attack.
After placing 50 points into strength a character gains +50 attack.
After Placing 50 points into intelligence a character gains +300 magic attack.
Bruiser buff gives +6 attack and +100 magic attack.
Assassin buff Increase physical/melee damage to players.


Now, I'll point out how it needs to be for a perfectly equal ratio.(Changes in bold.)


Upon leveling, a character gains +1.5 attack, and +9 magic attack.
Upon placing a point in strength, a character gains +1 attack.
Upon placing a point in intelligence, a character gains +6 magic attack.
When upgrade a weapon +1, the weapon gains +10 attack and +60 magic attack if applicable.
At +15 a weapon gains +150 attack and +900 magic attack.
After Placing 50 points into strength a character gains +50 attack.
After Placing 50 points into intelligence a character gains +300 magic attack.
Bruiser buff gives 17 attack and 102 magic attack.
Assassin buff increase physical/melee and ranged/elemental damage to players.


Now for a little explaining.

We will assume a warrior puts every point in strength up to level 50. And we will assume a sorceress puts every point in int up to level 50.

1 str is 1 attack, and 1 int is 6 magic attack.
Upon leveling, both classes gain 1.5 attack and 1 magic attack.
Which is the equivalent of 1.5 strength, and .16 intelligence.
For this to be an even gain. You need to gain 9 magic attack per level. Which would be 1.5 intelligence.


I pushed this ratio out to weapon enchants.
Currently, enchanting a weapon +1 is +10 attack and +40 magic attack.

This is the equivalent of 10 strength for a warrior. But only 6.66 intelligence for a sorceress.
For this to be an even gain. You need to gain +60 magic attack for enchanting a weapon +1.

This holds true all the way out to +15.



Even if you reduce the attack gained for leveling to 1. Then you still need to increase the magic attack gained to +6


This difference would only become more pronounced the higher in level you go.
At level 50, it would be 75 attack, and 50 magic attack.
Which comes out to leveling a warrior being over 800% MORE EFFECTIVE.

It should be 75 attack and 450 magic attack.
Which follows the 1:6 ratio of STR:INT.



Thank you for reading, if I did my math wrong, please let me know and I will correct it.



EDIT:
Added in bruiser buff and Assassin buff.

Bryan.Fury

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Bryan.Fury
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PostedNov 26, 2012 6:55 am
1) Earth bind is overpowered. 10s of effect duration, while all the other classes have definitelly way MUCH less (Warrior 3s and Paladin 7s) and need more than a Sorcerer. Rebalance it by giving to every class the same effect duration.

[What is the situation now betwheen the 2 mages classes]
-Sorceress = Earth Bind = 10s; 15m range; 30s cooldown; 1s cast; (Stats at level 3)

[What i suggest]
-Sorceress = Earth Bind = 5s effect; 15m range; 15s cooldown; 0,5s cast; (Stats at level 3)

Sorcerer is a DD class, not a debuff one, it should even not have it at all. Personally i think that this skill should be moved to the Shadowmage class instead, since the main role of a Shadowmage is Support/Secondary DD/Debuffer.

2) Damage definitelly is a bit low, a boost of 10% at least would make the Sorcerer more a DD.

3) If the range is gonna be increased, the Shadomage and in the future the Archer class must have it the same range aswell.

4) Sorcerer is the tipically glass cannon, so it's not necessary to increase the HP Pool or the Regen, since this class is basically made by Damage and not resistance.

5) I would suggest to make the buffs the Sorcerer can give ALSO party buffs, but i don't know if that would work, because they are single target for a reson: you can buff your summon. But the solution can be easy, make them affect yourself, the party and also the summon. So instead of buff 1 person at time you can avoid waste mana points and do it 1 time for all.

Shadow127

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PostedNov 26, 2012 8:23 pm
Sorc class seems very gimped.

MPure

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PostedNov 26, 2012 11:38 pm   Last edited by MPure on Nov 27, 2012 12:06 am. Edited 1 time in total
Anyway. Upon further tests with syn (with his maxed out RVR gear) My gear isn't very much lower then his current set either way.

First result syn wins, he proced a stun and a crit on his aoe

Second I won with 500 HP

Third, he wins

(his sorc, my warrior)

Anyway. Just thought I'd throw that out there, and if animations are changed, sorc would effectively be casting twice as often. Further balance tests would be required if such a change was made.

synster14

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synster14
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PostedNov 26, 2012 11:59 pm
MPure wrote:
Anyway. Upon further tests with syn (with his maxed out RVR gear)

First result syn wins, he proced a stun and a crit on his aoe

Second I won with 500 HP

(his sorc, my warrior)

Anyway. Just thought I'd throw that out there, and if animations are changed, sorc would effectively be casting twice as often. Further balance tests would be required if such a change was made.  



I was waiting to post until I fought warriors/paladins with the RvR gear.

But so far. The damage is much closer to what you would expect from a sorceress.
I expect against someone of equal RvR gear, it will be much the same as it was pre-RvR.

But, as Pure said, testing to be had!

synster14

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synster14
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PostedNov 27, 2012 2:15 am
Yeah, double post, I know.


But, I have a new suggestion. Don't actually buff the sorc at all, just fix the bugs and leave it at that until we hit cap level....


Looks like sorc can hold her own at the top of the list after all....under paladins that is.

MPure

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PostedNov 27, 2012 2:42 am
Yeah. As of legendary wep status, sorc wins vs warrior at least 75% of the time.

The animation complaint is related to all classes and isn't just a sorc/mage issue. Given the end game gear, it would appear sorc does not need a buff. Wink
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