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Taz

Aeria: Product Manager
Taz
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PostedNov 22, 2012 9:30 pm   Last edited by Taz on Nov 25, 2012 1:48 pm. Edited 1 time in total

[Class Discussion] Sorceress

Hail Dragon Knights!

Everyone has had a chance to dig in, get their hands dirty, and try out the classes in DK Online. We have received a tremendous amount of feedback and many suggestions. We are reading and compiling everything.

For this thread we want to focus specifically on the Sorceress. How does the class feel to you if you have played it, or have played against it? How does it rank against other classes? What can be improved? What might need to be balanced better? Let us know here!

Please keep all feedback constructive and specific to the Sorceress class. Easiest way to do this is to not respond to other people, post your feedback and leave what other people post alone. Flames will be removed, and any useful feedback within them will be lost--so please do not flame, your feedback is important.

 
Sorceress Feedback Summary

    Skills:
    -Damage Adjustments required
    -Cooldown reduction
    -Skills tweaking
    -Casting Animation Locks/Delays
    -Adjust Range of Spells
    -Stack Speed Reduction
    -Modify Assassin and Bruiser Buff
    -Zephyr
    -More lower AOE
    -HP drain

    Elemental summon:
    -Elemental Needs Control
    -Effective Taunt
    -Added Utility
    -Elemental Heal does not require targeting pet
    -Party member unable to attack Elemental

    Character:
    -Health Point Adjustment

    Misc:
    -Instant pots
    -Magic Runes dropable

 


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coduxs

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PostedNov 22, 2012 9:49 pm
I feel that it is reasonably balanced. I haven't played as a Sorceress yet, but hopefully others can expand on my generalization >Smile

Un.Leashed

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PostedNov 22, 2012 10:23 pm
1. Spell bar upon casting:


As the most discussed and frustrating issue on sorcerers, this is by far (in my opinion) the thing that needs the most attention regarding to this class since I think it’s one of the main reasons that sorcerers aren’t being played that much.

Upon clicking to cast a spell, the first thing that happens is to load the spell bar AND THEN the animation starts and actually performs. This is bad enough on it’s own and adding the fact that we’re “locked down” this whole time, makes it almost impossible to hit and run from anything or anyone especially with some of the spells that take so much time to charge.
“Kitting” isn’t a word applied to sorcerers while this issue prevails. And it shouldn’t.

As soon as the spell bar fills up, the animation should’ve already been performed and we should be “free” to walk away. Besides the fact that some skills might take a little bit more time to perform than it should (lightning storm for example), that extra second on the animation after the bar is full, is just unnecessary and pointless.


2. Cast Speed:

As a sorcerer and a PvP kind of player i love the possibility to kite people/mobs and as mage, long cast speed abilities just ruins it.

Damage oriented melee classes for example just owns mages because of that. Long channeling spells just give them the time to hit mages without a problem and adding roots on even makes it worst.

I know mages have a cast speed spell but the cooldown is awful and just 60secs is not good enough.
Having a cast speed stat as a possibility to build a mage would be awesome in this game. For example in runes/gear/stats. And I don’t even see the benefict for Paganfire Supine Gloves bonus effect of having +30 attack speed when they’re a sorcerer’s oriented equipment.


3. Damage:

Sorcerers are usually the highest damage classes with huge bursts… The so called glass cannions and in DK, that’s not what's happening.

Sorcerers are just squishy as Hard, with no sustainability and with the same or less damage than warriors. THIS shouldn’t be happening. Even tho i'd love to have a minimum sustain on sorcerers, i agree that's the SM's jobs to have but at least add more damage on sorcerers' abilities in a way to balance things.

Maybe instead of fixed damage, use % bonus upon each level.


4. Sustainability:

Every other class got at least almost 1k more hp than sorcerers (unless you’re a paladin, which can reach +3k hp) and SM for example got heals over it and adding the fact that warriors and SM got both movement speed buff it makes way harder to PvP and kite people with sorcerers.
And the argument that sorcerers have like 3/4 cc spells, it's barely acceptable since it's a 50% chance and others classes have them too, adding the fact of all issues in point 1.

If there's no way to add sustainability on sorcerers, at least add more movement speed (150 for example).
Zephyr's buff is not even a valid point since it's the most useless spell in all DK in my opinion.. a 5 seconds ms buff with 10mins cooldown? ...


5. Vouchers in a Sorcerer’s point of view:

Everyone knows that vouchers are very usefull and there's another huge problem according to this in my opinion... And the vouchers I’m talking are the ones dropped from elites.

I think all classes can solo them except sorcerers. There should be a way to make this fair. If you're in a party, all members should get 1 voucher, by the same method people get Inaferus Wings on side quest.

It's not fair that everyone can solo elites and get the voucher to themselves and sorcerers' only option is to party and share with other party members one voucher at a time. It's already hard to know the respawn time on elites since people just camp it, and adding the fact that sorcerers need to share it makes it even more unfair.



In my opinion, sorcerers really need some rework and a close eye into them. They are a valuable class but it seems they are way too underpowered at the moment… especially in PvP terms.

RedivivusPopuli

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PostedNov 22, 2012 10:36 pm
I think Sorceress are good,no problem with them some sorcerers are good but not that good to be unbeatable,it most about char. build they supporters so if they def by warriors their very effective

Sehlyet

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PostedNov 22, 2012 11:22 pm

Sorceress needs work.

The sorceress class is clearly not on par with other classes and needs tweaked to be more competitive. I agree with most points of unleashed so i wont repeat them.

just want to elaborate on status effects and mention elementals.

Status effects are currently capped at 50% success rate. Considering a sorceress dies in 3 hits you're basically flipping a coin: heads stun lands and you kill them tails it doesn't and they kill you. I prefer knowing a skill is going to work and not just gambling. My suggestion is higher % to inflict status effects preferably 100% with a cool down that reflects stun time and cast time so one person can't stun lock.

Many have complained about the elemental specifically getting it to do what you want. My suggestion is just increasing control so when you tell it to attack a player while you switch to another it doesn't auto switch to another there's more issues with it then that but that is my primary problem.

cyanreid

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PostedNov 23, 2012 1:05 am
From every other game that I have played, sorcerers usually fill one (or more) of the following roles:

  • High spike damage, usually with higher sustained damage than other classes as well. (Lineage II, most traditional mmos)
  • Superior AoE capabilities; either with easy-to-use or damaging AoEs (usually both). (Ragnarok Online, most mmos)
  • Higher versatility than other classes, with a considerably higher skill cap but very effective at filling multiple roles (Guild Wars 2, many modern mmos).

Right now, the sorceress in DK online suffers from the following:

  • Not very high spike damage. Unfortunately, what advantage sorcs have is usually matched by warriors, and the ranged 'advantage' is often nulled by stuff like quick spawns and chain aggroing.
  • Has only two AoE skills at level 35. I understand that we'll probably get all three aoes by level 50, but with their cooldowns and the lack of self-sustained healing (without pots), it's scary to even use those aoes.
  • Supposedly higher versatility, but ruined by the 50% chance on most skills. I could understand the damage skills with a CC component like call lightning, but sleep, in particular, has no excuse being a 50% chance to work; it's so unreliable that a number of right-tree sorcs I spoke to either skipped it altogether or just use it for a running away tool.

The strengths listed at the beginning are supposed to compensate for the weaknesses of the class, which are in fact still very readily apparent in DK online:

  • Sorcs are still glass cannons. We have the lowest HP pool of all of the classes, and are forced into robes for the third and higher rune slots which further cripples our defense (this is slightly compensated for the right side, but without high level investments, it's not possible to get defense and damage on one character.
  • Sorcs still suffer from casting delay problems. In fact, one of the most gregarious annoyances I have is that the so called "instant" skills - firestorm and the likes - still has about a 0.5-1 second animation delay. Not just those either - the ADDED animation delay on most cast time skills makes kiting difficult - if not impossible - to do in the game.
  • Cooldowns. I point you right to Zephyr - a situational escape skill with a 10 minute cooldown and three points and ask 'what the Hard are the developers thinking when they designed this stuff?'

Most of the sorcs being entirely serious when they say 'elemental is practically required for soloing at higher levels' is a pretty good indicator of how the class actually performs in the 'glass cannon' category.

My suggestions are to increase at least one of the categories that actually makes sorcs good. I would think that increasing spike damage or their aoe capabilities would be enough for most of us I would think.

Of course, being the only class that can't really solo elites is also pretty silly.

PrincessKiss2

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PostedNov 23, 2012 1:18 am
Un.Leashed wrote:
1. Spell bar upon casting:
*clip*

2. Cast Speed:
*clip*

3. Damage:
*clip*

4. Sustainability:
*clip*

5. Vouchers in a Sorcerer’s point of view:
*clip*

In my opinion, sorcerers really need some rework and a close eye into them. They are a valuable class but it seems they are way too underpowered at the moment… especially in PvP terms.  

I agree with everything in this post. I am currently playing Sorceress. With the low hp I feel like I can't even make it past a bunch of low lvl mobs without coming close to death. And even if I try to kill them unlike other classes that it takes 1 hit it takes two even with a build that goes with mostly int. The movement speed is an issue all in itself being the slowest of the other races and the buff doesn't help one bit. Oh 5 second incesss in movement speed which is useless if you trying to run in the temple 5 seconds doesn't help at all and have to wait 10 min to cast it again by then you are dead if you trying to meet someone on another floor.

This class has a lot of potential but needs a lot of work to get it there. and what Un.Leashed and cyanreid said is basically what needs to be fix with it.

Bryan.Fury

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PostedNov 23, 2012 8:07 am
Un.Leashed wrote:
1. Spell bar upon casting:

As the most discussed and frustrating issue on sorcerers, this is by far (in my opinion) the thing that needs the most attention regarding to this class since I think it’s one of the main reasons that sorcerers aren’t being played that much.

Upon clicking to cast a spell, the first thing that happens is to load the spell bar AND THEN the animation starts and actually performs. This is bad enough on it’s own and adding the fact that we’re “locked down” this whole time, makes it almost impossible to hit and run from anything or anyone especially with some of the spells that take so much time to charge.  
I think there is only ONE REAL problem with Sorceress (and with Shadowmage too, since that problem is shared with both classes) and that problem is the "Animation Lock" you described.

On many games i played there was the animation chained with the CHANNELING ONLY. This mean that after the channeling is done, the mage is free to move.

What i mean?

[That is what should happen]
Channeling + Animation
Cast + Cooldown

[That is what happen NOW]
Channeling
Cast + Animation
Cooldown

That is wrong. Point.

On the first example the situation is that:
Channeling is 1s long, Cast is 1s long = Skill is exactly how it's wrote: 2s casting (1+1)

On the second one, that is what NOW happen the situation is that:
Channeling is 1s, Animation is 1s long, Cast is 1s long = The skill is not 2s casting (1+1) but 3 seconds.

Other than that, i think there aren't other problems.

BryanFury - Leader |Site|Forum|

MPure

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PostedNov 23, 2012 8:21 am
Being ranged is a huge asset. While tweaking this class, bare this in mind. I agree it needs a little something, just tread carefully.

greenhair

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PostedNov 23, 2012 8:26 am
MPure wrote:
Being ranged is a huge asset. While tweaking this class, bare this in mind. I agree it needs a little something, just tread carefully.  


+1. be sure not to create an OP class.

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