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NeilEden

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PostedJul 14, 2011 7:28 pm

Why does Eden Eternal need Administrative rights to run

Windows 7 x64 computer.

Eden Eternal is installed to P:\Program Files(x86)\Aeriagames\Edeneternal\

The only programs there are the uninstall, _launcher.exe and launcher.exe.

No shortcut created by the installer.

I have been able to play the game using launcher.exe - but that requires me to run-as Administrator.

Why does your game require admin rights to run?
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AKFrost

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PostedJul 14, 2011 7:31 pm
Because it, like most games, writes data to your Hard Drive, which Windows 7's UAC decides requires admin privilege to do.

NeilEden

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PostedJul 14, 2011 7:36 pm
AKFrost wrote:
Because it, like most games, writes data to your Hard Drive, which Windows 7's UAC decides requires admin privilege to do.  



AKFrost, I have many programs that write the the hard-drive that do not require admin access.

Heck, I can play world of warcraft, wizard101, and use OpenOffice.

Admin rights is ONLY needed for installation or to bypass security for places the application has no reason to write/read from.

Still thank you for the guess.

Smile

blackhal0

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PostedJul 14, 2011 7:43 pm
if you really want to skip that box you can turn the UAC off

NeilEden

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PostedJul 14, 2011 7:46 pm
blackhal0 wrote:
if you really want to skip that box you can turn the UAC off  


I LIKE UAC, it has saved my parents from at least 5 fake "your computer has a virus" attacks.

I just dont want this game to need admin rights.

AKFrost

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PostedJul 14, 2011 8:05 pm
Let me be more specific then.

This game, which is made by a Taiwanese company (and therefore is not on a list of recognized vendors), needs to patch every time it runs (meaning, writing files to a commonly-shared area of your hard drive, as opposed to open office which writes files to your account folders, and it's a recognized software anyway.), and thus, UAC doesn't like it.

NeilEden

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PostedJul 14, 2011 8:21 pm
AKFrost wrote:
Let me be more specific then.

This game, which is made by a Taiwanese company (and therefore is not on a list of recognized vendors), needs to patch every time it runs (meaning, writing files to a commonly-shared area of your hard drive, as opposed to open office which writes files to your account folders, and it's a recognized software anyway.), and thus, UAC doesn't like it.  


And yet on the filesystem "Authenticated users" have modify rights to the directories where the product is installed.

Wizard101 also scan's and potentially patches the game each time you run, yet it does not require admin rights.

Unless the program is creating new registry key trees on each run or using msiexec to uninstall and install each time launcher.exe is run it is unlikely that they need admin access to run after initial installation.

I am really posting this because Product Managers and Program Managers don't allocate time for Dev and Test unless enough people say "hey, please fix this".

It seem like a small issue, but security issues are hitting the gaming instrustry.

If every person who found that the game running as admin makes them worried about the safety of the game or their computer actually posted, the problem would be resovled.

Of course I could be wrong, maybe they have reviewed the issue and determined that to solve the problem massive re-writes to the code and game engine would be needed.

However I would want to know that as well so I can make a well infomed decition about what games to allow on my computer.

rgagnon24

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PostedSep 05, 2014 10:38 pm
AKFrost wrote:
Let me be more specific then.

This game, which is made by a Taiwanese company (and therefore is not on a list of recognized vendors), needs to patch every time it runs (meaning, writing files to a commonly-shared area of your hard drive, as opposed to open office which writes files to your account folders, and it's a recognized software anyway.), and thus, UAC doesn't like it.  


I agree with the OP that this is not a good reason for needing Admin rights.

Writing to the hard drive (in general) DOES NOT require administrative privileges. Writing to C:\Windows\ or C:\Program Files\ or C:\Program Files (x86)\ DOES.

If the game needs to update or whatever all the time, then it SHOULD NOT install to any of those locations. Games that need to do this usually create or default to install in C:\Games\ some place to avoid the need to Administrative Privileges.

My son installed Aura Kingdom, and I have since made him remove it for two reasons:

1) I am not around all the time to input the admin password just so he can play
2) Giving the launcher admin rights EVERY TIME it runs is a HUGE SECURITY PROBLEM. The installer at that time will have privileges to do anything it wants after the password is put in. Potentially Unwanted Programs (PUPs), or other malware can be installed easily. If this is the goal of Aeria games, then you will find your company on the short list of software that programs like AdwCleaner, MalwareBytes, etc. consider to be unfriendly. If not, it leaves your running program open to attack from other possible malware that can ride on top of your admin rights in order to do something bad to the user's PC

If your company wants to create a game properly, WITHOUT the need to admin rights, you would have known how to do this before creating this stupid requirement to have right required every time it runs. You would also have support technicians that KNOW WHY it was needed, and understand how UAC works under different versions of Windows.

Suggesting that people turn off UAC is an even WORSE security problem as the entire computer becomes at risk all the time, and not just when one of your games is run.

I didn't watch the entire installer run when it did, but if it has the option during installation (which almost all properly written installers have) to change the installation location, I will see if changing the default location to C:\Games\ will remove the repeated need for admin rights.

Programs DON'T request administrative rights on their own just to have them. What they do is attempt to write to a protected location, and then the operating system will produce the UAC prompt. Now, if the program is in a location not under UAC control, no prompt should appear.

AKFrost

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PostedSep 05, 2014 10:48 pm
rgagnon24 wrote:
 


You're right, it's not a good reason to require admin rights, but telling Aeria how to "create a game properly" is probably barking up the wrong tree. Aeria a publisher, not a development shop. The developers of EE and AK, as I mentioned, is a taiwanese company by the name of "Easyfun." Aeria can put in a request a fix for this problem, but I would imagine that in the grand scheme of things the developers will probably consider it of lesser importance than making new content/games to bring in money.

That being said, even in this age there are many American ISV's that can't get windows security right, and instead just expects UAC to be off and/or people running with admin powers all the time. It's a pretty long shot to expect a Taiwanese Company that's probably still using Windows XP to have the faintest idea on how to actually work UAC. The fact that EE/AK is designed this way also points to that.

rgagnon24

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PostedSep 05, 2014 10:54 pm
AKFrost wrote:
rgagnon24 wrote:
 


You're right, it's not a good reason to require admin rights, but telling Aeria how to "create a game properly" is probably barking up the wrong tree. Aeria a publisher, not a development shop. The developers of EE and AK, as I mentioned, is a taiwanese company by the name of "Easyfun." Aeria can put in a request a fix for this problem, but I would imagine that in the grand scheme of things the developers will probably consider it of lesser importance than making new content/games to bring in money.

That being said, even in this age there are many American ISV's that can't get windows security right, and instead just expects UAC to be off and/or people running with admin powers all the time. It's a pretty long shot to expect a Taiwanese Company that's probably still using Windows XP to have the faintest idea on how to actually work UAC. The fact that EE/AK is designed this way also points to that.  


I see a couple of things fundamentally wrong with your reply:

SECURITY is not a thing of "lesser importance" for most people. If it is of lesser importance for the game developer, then they don't care for their users' security very much.

If Aeria, as a publisher does not care what their content providers are doing, or whether they are producing quality work, then why would I trust them to let them install anything to my computer?

It makes Aeria appear like a "Steam wannabe" without the quality behind it.

Also... Thanks for the very fast reply.
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