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Rekikyo

Rank 5.1
Rekikyo
Joined
25 Nov 2008
Posts
8436
Location
Gaia Adrion Necria United States
PostedDec 29, 2012 2:27 pm
shane247 wrote:


Its quite worrying that a general player like myself and every other player can have such conversations with GM's over such matters, i heard that you have asked GM's wether certain items are in peoples accounts and even got a positive reply telling you it wasnt in there account and not to worry, this behaviour is quite worrying considering you are not an employee of AGE and do not work on Shaiya, if the PM/GM teams are so good then why would they need to confer with you over such matters ?? most mathematical equations you come out with on these forums are pure hyperthetical nonsense based purely on your own base figures and not ones based on coded maths from within the game of which you cannot see unless you hacked the codes to see them or are a Dev at Nexon, complete assumptions, even the PM's Gm's have at times even interupted your posts to tell you this themselves i wonder what you say to my accusations you may think your smarter and 1 step ahead of everyone else on the forums, but remember, reap what you sow.  


You're twisting some statements here.

I have Asked a GM whether the item someone was trading me was legit, while it was still in their possession (Dark Mage Stones that were supposedly placeholders). The GM confirmed that those items were just Dungeon drops and not GM placeholders.

I have on a couple occasions attempted to get a GM response in regards to other player's possessions regarding my guild (Theft of my GH, Theft of a personal set of Ferox I lent to a player), and I was rejected on those accounts, saying "Pick your officers more carefully," and "We cannot divulge the possessions of X player after trade has been made."

So your first statement is false. It combines assumptions from two very different situations.

As for mathematical formulas; So you're calling every person who has dissected stats and their correlation to the game is wrong? I didn't do all the research myself. I'm using the time proven formulas every player uses, that are plastered in Avyn, Aes, and every other reputable player's player guides, proven by hours upon hours of tests.

You're also naive to think that no one's dissected this game's code purely to understand how something works. Yes. How do you think Illegal servers get their game? They DL the code and program, and upload it on a private server.... There's just as many players who have dissected it purely for fun and to see future drop rates, etc. I trust their extrapolations.

I also proved that specific PM wrong in that one instance where they attempted to correct me. In addition, I have corrected THEM on a couple of their promotions, where they placed a wipe date only 3 days after the promo of ANOTHER PM. In other words, no one's infallible. Especially someone overworked, doing the job of 5 men, who briefly glances something on the forums.

I am not omniscient. I will never be 100% correct. But, I typically am more knowledgeable than most people on forums. I know how the client is changed from origin to EN. I know the principals behind balance. And I certainly make an effort to use my friendships to their full advantage.

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ToBeFeared

Rank 4
ToBeFeared
Joined
28 Apr 2010
Posts
1869
Location
United States
PostedDec 29, 2012 3:40 pm
styfz wrote:
I merely stated facts  


What you stated was a series of opinions mixed in with 1 or 2 facts.

"you don't really know what you QQ'ing about. " <---- Opinion

"there's your solution" <------ Opinnion

"perfect lapisia is NOT a GM service" <----- Fact (replaces the GM service so assumptions can be made that they will be closely related)

"all those stating that PX was meant to be a pre-ep4 server" <---- misunderstanding of what was really said


styfz wrote:

trust me, no further research is needed, I was on PX on day one, read everything about it, and bailed back to OS on day 6 or 7.
why?? years of dealing with AGE have taught me some stuff, and while most ppl around are in a perpetual denial state, there are some trends and patterns that are undeniable

you call PX a "pre-ep4 like server (actually more like pre-ep5, since pre-ep4 there were no enchants or OJ's), I call it a "GM services free server", cuz things won't ever be like they were 4/5 years ago.

now, everyone knew way before PX opened that GM services were due to be replaced by quicker solutions, the placeholder system consumes too much time both for players and AGE. first sign of it was, like you said, PLH, before PX opened.
now, with PX being a "GM service free server", what will happen when all GM services are replaced by player services?? simple, PX becomes another OS.

everyone knew the odd-situation in PX was temporary and in time it would become just another regular shaiya server, there were many discussions back then about it, everyone came to the same conclusion, if you believed otherwise, well, AGE ensnared you and you fell for it, and for that I'm sorry (see, I said I'm sorry, no trolling now)  


I never said the actual current state of Phoenix is Pre-EP4, but rather that it was MEANT to be like a pre-EP4 server.

If they had stopped at only eliminating GM services, then yes, it would have been a GM Service free server. The fact of the matter is that they did not stop at just that. If you check the Web Mall of Phoenix verses OS, you will notice the difference. They purposely changed the prices on some items to match the prices of OS server Web Mall Pre-EP4. Further more they elinated some other enhancements that are doable on OS such as Enchant/link bonus. It is not a GM service, it is a game feature that can be activated/deactivated.

I too am well aware of how AGE works and what to expect from them. The point of my Thread was not to QQ, but rather to add to the pressure for AGE to be more responsible and to not make promises it can't/won't keep. AGE has become very predictable and we know they're next move well before they even make it.

Love what you do and do what you love.

Eaton08

Rank 1
Eaton08
Joined
12 Jun 2008
Posts
319
Location
United Kingdom
PostedDec 29, 2012 4:08 pm
ToBeFeared wrote:
I too am well aware of how AGE works and what to expect from them. The point of my Thread was not to QQ, but rather to add to the pressure for AGE to be more responsible and to not make promises it can't/won't keep. AGE has become very predictable and we know they're next move well before they even make it.  


Oh cool, so let's predict the next 3 years of Shaiya movement with AGE shall we? Sure they're somewhat predictable but you've got no idea what they'll specifically do o.o

Also, add pressure to AGE? You're one person, you're not even a fingernail's worth of pressure for the AGE team, there's no pressure to be added as the Shaiya owners (not AGE but the owners/developers over the years) do one thing, yet the playing community says another. It's pretty much always been that way, so there's nothing to be done in that sense.

ToBeFeared

Rank 4
ToBeFeared
Joined
28 Apr 2010
Posts
1869
Location
United States
PostedDec 29, 2012 5:06 pm
Eaton08 wrote:
ToBeFeared wrote:
I too am well aware of how AGE works and what to expect from them. The point of my Thread was not to QQ, but rather to add to the pressure for AGE to be more responsible and to not make promises it can't/won't keep. AGE has become very predictable and we know they're next move well before they even make it.  


Oh cool, so let's predict the next 3 years of Shaiya movement with AGE shall we? Sure they're somewhat predictable but you've got no idea what they'll specifically do o.o

Also, add pressure to AGE? You're one person, you're not even a fingernail's worth of pressure for the AGE team, there's no pressure to be added as the Shaiya owners (not AGE but the owners/developers over the years) do one thing, yet the playing community says another. It's pretty much always been that way, so there's nothing to be done in that sense.  


AGE is a business just like any other business out there. Shaiya's owners are now Nexon and the publisher of Shaiya is AGE. The GM team assigned to Shaiya works for AGE not for Nexon or themselves. Like any other busines, AGE has products to offer to its customers. These products are in the form of Games which they publish and the customers play.

Without its customers, AGE cannot exist since it is a customer dependent busines. Meaning the customers are the ones that provide an income for AGE and allows AGE to exist and function. If the customers are unhappy and decide to all stop using AGE's products, the company will cease to exist. Therefore, it is in the best interest of AGE to please most of its customers. It does not need to please everyone since that is not posible.

As AGE's loyal customers, we are entitled to request (sometimes demand if we feel we are privilaged enough) things from AGE which will make us happier with their products and compel us to invest even more time/money into their products.

I know I am only one person, that is why I am not directly sending AGE e-mails/tickets attempting to get them to straighten up. That is why I made this thread public as to get others with the same interests as me involved and show to AGE that in fact, its customers are not fully happy with its services.

While it is true that AGE has very little impact on how the game works and how things get fixed, they do have an impact on the marketing perspective of the game, since after all, they are the ones presenting the Game to the public and not the DEVs. This aspect of the game not only involes prices on services and items, but also how the customers are kept up-to-date and informed of changes and updates. How they present the game could result in the game being prosperous or the game failing and being completely forgotten.

The kind of pressure I am talking about has been presented for many different circumstances over many years in other more informal and irrational manners, ie. riots, strikes, protests, looting, etc.

I hope I have made myself clear enough.

As to your comment about predicting the next 3 years of Shaiya, don't read more into my statement then you need to and don't make irrational/exhagerated assumptions. Since it seems I have to spell everything out for you, what I meant is that whenever the developers introduce new content, we already know how AGE will introduce the content to the customers and what they will do to make sure that they always make a profit.

yaynot

Rank 2
yaynot
Joined
30 Sep 2009
Posts
475
Location
United States
PostedDec 29, 2012 8:58 pm
Well, considering what old players were sent to entice them to return.....



It's no wonder people think of it as an "oldschool" server, not just a "GM services free" server.

I thought it was dang near false advertising even when it was first emailed. To see it again now... all I can say is

hahahahahahahaha!!!!!!

Chicken Little was right, you know.

TotallyJay

Rank 3
TotallyJay
Joined
17 Dec 2010
Posts
1583
Location
United States
PostedDec 29, 2012 10:50 pm
A new item mall approach.

Spend at your own pace.

yaynot

Rank 2
yaynot
Joined
30 Sep 2009
Posts
475
Location
United States
PostedDec 29, 2012 10:52 pm
grind for real power too!

Chicken Little was right, you know.

FalseDeath

Rank 1
FalseDeath
Joined
04 Sep 2012
Posts
212
Location
United States
PostedDec 29, 2012 11:06 pm
yaynot wrote:
Well, considering what old players were sent to entice them to return.....



It's no wonder people think of it as an "oldschool" server, not just a "GM services free" server.

I thought it was dang near false advertising even when it was first emailed. To see it again now... all I can say is

hahahahahahahaha!!!!!!  


You know the funny thing is an ex GS predicted this very thing, that they'd eventually start doing what they said they wouldn't do on the server. I semi knew she was right, but I didn't think ( or didn't want to think ) they'd lie to us.

styfz

Rank 1
styfz
Joined
02 Apr 2010
Posts
380
Location
Figueira da Foz Portugal
PostedDec 30, 2012 1:03 am
FalseDeath wrote:
You know the funny thing is an ex GS predicted this very thing, that they'd eventually start doing what they said they wouldn't do on the server. I semi knew she was right, but I didn't think ( or didn't want to think ) they'd lie to us.  


I don't think it was only that ex-GS that predicted that.. 6 days of discussing it with 10+ ppl and we all came to that conclusion, and hauled our ***** back to OS. But like you, many ppl "didn't want to believe".

I'm very pragmatic by nature, better to be suprised by something than be let down by it. So I don't get to "want to believe", I simply watch the trends and patterns and try to predict the worst case scenario.
And PX (not the server but the "concept") looked like a fail to me since day 4 or 5 into it. It was too "Utopic" to be true(Power to the grinders, cmon, if they want power to the grinders just delete item mall and make everything drop ingame... I don't think so...).

Are they ever gonna merge or link PX with OS like I read somewhere in this thread? No, they won't, most likely close it if it stops being profitable.

Are the GM Services gonna be replaced by ingame "Player Services" and be implemented in PX? Yep, you can be sure. Even Max Oj's (Perfect Rec Runes from combo system. actually the combo system is what can excuse them on anything they implement, and almost everything will need AP items)

So in the end you get a server where, spending way more than in OS, you get the same ambient as OS. Totally defeating the so-called "original purpose" of the server

Avitra

Rank 1
Joined
23 Jul 2009
Posts
200
Location
United Kingdom
PostedDec 30, 2012 4:22 am
I dun wanna reply to this minefield, but oh well Confused

To be fair, a lot of the things that made pheonix crash and burn (I wonder if it will rise from the flames this time...) I don't think were really AGE's fault.

Messed up economy came from the mistake that NPC'ing NT items injected a heck of a lot of gold in there, coupled with OS mentality. Balanced pvp will never exist till, you know, Nexon actually balance the classes, though I think there wasn't as much imbalance between people with wallets who could afford 'rare' gears like on OS and those that couldn't, as those rare gears just didn't exist on Pheonix (and I class rare gears as those with high enchants too, 'cos well, they should have been rare, not a neccessity to compete...). New Item Mall approach? I believe the idea here was to put things so that farming could pay for the Item Mall items that a few players could buy, and the items 'necessary to compete' were farmable (unlike on OS were you need, say, worships in 1-15 which are only ap). A sort of set back to times before past unscrupulous, idiotic PMs decided to release 'uber' gears only for ap to the point where the game cannot function without them (no blame of current PM's, they're only reaping what their forebears sowed). The fact that AGE's idea was naive at best isn't really their fault.

I think the main problem with Pheonix not turning out to be what we were lead to believe isn't due to deliberate deception from AGE, but rather their total naivity of Nexon coding and player attitude, coupled with over stretched man-power. The fact that a whole ton of us took a look at pheonix, put our cynic hats on, and predicted what would happen, is besides the point. I like to think of it as a triumph of hope over experience for AGE, and who wouldn't want a company who at least has hope that things could get better, and are willing to give it a go?

As for PLapisia, well they were something Nexon did, not AGE. I know it's hard to believe, but, from various sources, it appears AGE have as much idea as to what new things are coming to Shaiya as we do, so promises for pheonix are only as good as far as trusting that Nexon won't switch things up... I suppose though, they did have the option to not sell them in the Item Mall... I would love to know what the AGE mentality was there (without resorting to being too cynical Confused)

With all these new changes in game, I now just view Shaiya as a new game, and deal with it. It's a pitty pheonix has swung so heavily in favour of ap spenders now. I live in hope that these PLapisia will become tradeable, to balance the players again.
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